The Vescosity of Manual Transmission Fluid

"thebigbossyboss" (thebigbossyboss) 12/16/2013 at 09:04 • Filed to: None

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Hey guys. Now as we know, I currently drive a 2003 Chevrolet cavalier 5 speed manual and live in a frozen wasteland. (For example it`s currently -23C, or -9 F). When it gets this cold, I find it pretty hard to change gears. As if my transaxle fluid is very thick or frozen. Is this normal? Are there tricks you can use to minimize this?

In our washer fluid, I usually buy the -35 rated stuff, and then pour in some anti freeze. Can you put a bit of anti freeze in transaxle fluid, or is that stupid? Chime in below.

Edit: Thanks to Oppo, I now undertsand why this is a terrible idea. I will not be proceeding with this "plan".

jariten1781 > thebigbossyboss 12/16/2013 at 09:11

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Can you put a bit of anti freeze in transaxle fluid

No, absolutely not.

It is normal for a car to be more difficult/notchy shifting in cold temperatures. You can let your car heat up first or just deal with it as long as there is no other contributing problem you'll be fine.

The Transporter > thebigbossyboss 12/16/2013 at 09:12

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Anti-freeze in your transaxle would kill it. If it's that tough to shift, then I would recommend switching to a lower weight transaxle oil.

Nibbles > thebigbossyboss 12/16/2013 at 09:12

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Do not put antifreeze in your transmission.

RamblinRover Luxury-Yacht > thebigbossyboss 12/16/2013 at 09:14

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Yes, difficulty shifting in extreme cold is normal. It is sometimes a good diea to use a lower viscosity fluid. A trick to reduce that might be to admix some automatic transmission fluid, as it still has anti-wear additives and other things good for a transaxle but is significantly lower viscosity than most gear oils. Don't overfill, though, you'd need to take some existing gear oil out. I'd also not go more than 1 in 4.

Don't put in antifreeze. To start with, your problem isn't water-style freezing, it's just the fluid getting much thicker in the cold (which is actually in the direction of freezing, but not like water). It's a glycol, and not miscible with gear oils to any extent - worse, it's hydrophilic (will store/attract condensate) and contains water, so unless you want your transaxle bearings to rust up...

themanwithsauce - has as many vehicles as job titles > thebigbossyboss 12/16/2013 at 09:15

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The best way to deal with it is to take a minute to row your gears a few times while your engine heats up. This will at least start to put some heat into the transmission before you get rolling.

Nibbles > thebigbossyboss 12/16/2013 at 09:17

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Also, the book says your tranny is supposed to run ATF. Syncromesh fluid is fine and may help curb your cold weather problems. I'd recommend Redline MTL

thebigbossyboss > RamblinRover Luxury-Yacht 12/16/2013 at 09:17

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Good to know. This is why I asked BEFORE I did anything stupid.

Nibbles > RamblinRover Luxury-Yacht 12/16/2013 at 09:17

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If he's never touched his fluid, the Getrag F23 came with ATF from the factory

davedave1111 > thebigbossyboss 12/16/2013 at 09:18

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No to the antifreeze. Have you ever replaced the tranny oil? It's normally a neglected job, so my first thought would be to give that a try - the notchiness will be because the oil is thickening up in the cold, but having new, correct-spec oil in the gearbox should help a little anyway.

thebigbossyboss > davedave1111 12/16/2013 at 09:20

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Yeah I changed it quite a while ago. According the car manual, the manual transaxle fluid doesn't need to be changed, but I think I will change it again soon. What is the difference between automatic and manual transaxle fluid??

thebigbossyboss > Nibbles 12/16/2013 at 09:20

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It was changed when I bought the car. Not sure what exactly was put it.

RamblinRover Luxury-Yacht > Nibbles 12/16/2013 at 09:22

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In that case, I'm not sure what he'd do to make it much lighter. That's a hard answer. It's quite tricky to get anything that light without a penetrant, and penetrants in a trans don't really help anything.

The two tricks I can think of are trace amounts of kerosene or using a larger quantity of heat-tolerant light machine oil/sewing machine oil (which Marvel Mystery Oil is one of). Not terribly great stuff at its usual alleged purposes, but lightening up ATF it might do okay at.

davedave1111 > thebigbossyboss 12/16/2013 at 09:25

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I don't think there's a big difference between manual and auto transmission oil, other than the thickness/viscosity - but I'm no expert. I do know that many manual gearboxes actually take 'ATF' these days.

RamblinRover Luxury-Yacht > thebigbossyboss 12/16/2013 at 09:26

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It depends heavily on what the gears are designed to run in, the design of oil circulation...

An older style box is likely to splash lubricate and use coarse-tooth gears. Both benefit from heavy gear oil. A newer box may have active circulation, finer gears, and smaller tolerances that require a thinner oil to infiltrate, and that makes for needing ATF or a special fluid.

Nibbles > thebigbossyboss 12/16/2013 at 09:26

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Honestly they're fairly similar. The thing about manual transmission fluids is they have friction modifiers designed to assist with shifting and reduce wear on the syncromesh

Arch Duke Maxyenko, Shit Talk Extraordinaire > thebigbossyboss 12/16/2013 at 09:28

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Lifetime fluid is bull shit. Change it out with some fresh stuff.

thebigbossyboss > Arch Duke Maxyenko, Shit Talk Extraordinaire 12/16/2013 at 09:30

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As I said: I already changed it once, and will change it again early in the new year (my car is about to sit for a couple weeks).

Kate's Dirty Sister > thebigbossyboss 12/16/2013 at 09:44

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Using antifreeze as windshield washer is environmentally irresponsible

thebigbossyboss > Kate's Dirty Sister 12/16/2013 at 09:48

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....that`s what winter windshield washer fluid is. Washer fluid and anti freeze. I just add my own. I know anti freeze isn`t good for the environment, but not being able to see out your windshield is potentially quite dangerous, and believe me, it has happened.

Zoom > thebigbossyboss 12/16/2013 at 09:56

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Use the best synthetic you can afford. I use a 75/90 (I live in Michigan) to protect the differential. Remember, the fluid also lubricates and protects the differential in a fwd transmission (transaxle) and diffs don't like something as thin as atf in the long run. So I would recommend a good synthetic motor oil. If you are over 100,000 miles, you may want to stay away from the ATF.

If you are under 100k, a synthetic atf will help.

Collin > thebigbossyboss 12/16/2013 at 12:18

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Just turn your car on and let it warm up for a little while before you get in and drive off. Not only will it be warm in the car, but it will also warm your driveline up. Sure it's environmentally irresponsible and increases the risk of your car getting stolen, but who cares?

thebigbossyboss > Collin 12/16/2013 at 16:12

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Where I live a walk by car theft is not a concern. The house across the street is watched by the cops 24/7 because of who lives there. Hell, I've been question myself for looking for the damn cat.

JEM > themanwithsauce - has as many vehicles as job titles 12/16/2013 at 16:14

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This. Exactly.

I live in Massachusetts and when it gets below 15 or so in the mornings I have the same problem with it not wanting to go into gear (and I'm running fully synthetic gear fluid). I let the truck idle for about 30-60 seconds and go through all the gears a couple times to "free" them up a bit.

Collin > thebigbossyboss 12/16/2013 at 16:50

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In that case, by all means warm up your car. It's not like 10 minutes of idling is going to burn down a rainforest or anything.